2022-10-13 Product Council Meeting notes



Discussion items

5 minAnnouncementsAll

Please submit questions about FOLIO in China to Alexis Manheim or twliu as soon as possible.

People should complete the "how to improve FOLIO" survey by Monday.

5 min

Request: Change the name from Queen Anne's Lace to Quince for FOLIO Q release?

Purpose: decision on whether to recommend a flower name change

Kristin Martin 

There was a discussion in the General channel on Slack as well.

The decision doesn't affect programming. Also noting that "Morning Glory" is typically abbreviated as "MG".

Outcome: The Product Council recommends that the Outreach SIG research and choose a different Q flower name that is shorter and lacking in a apostrophe. Vote yes or no.

45 min

SIG Updates

  • SIG conveners/reps put their notes in the template

Purpose: information sharing with the SIG representatives

AllSee "SIG Updates" heading below.
10 min

Documentation planning/Engagement with new member and existing members in new roles

  • two major needs:
    • Immediate need for a documentation coordinator
    • Longer term need - use as a way engage new members with specific role needs? Other roles could include a testing coordinator, roadmap coordinator, etc.
  • Potential for cross-council group to help orient new members and be able to share non-technical needs and roles that could be filled in the project

Please see notes from CC this week.

The contract with Marcia, the documentation coordinator, has ended, and the community has a need to fulfill this role.

Success: documentation continues to roll-out on the release schedule and new people are able to contribute to the documentation.

30 min

Roadmap update: revised charge for Prioritization and Roadmap Group

Review proposed charge

Jesse Koennecke 

The group that met previously as the roadmap group met again to review the feedback from WOLFcon. The result was the draft revised charge in the Google Doc. (The group continues to look for input on the draft charge.)

The group would manage the feature prioritization process (with a focus on the SIG activities and an input mechanism from the broader community).  It would work with the SIGs and Councils to update the themes and sub-themes as needed.

5 minagenda items for upcoming meetings

SIG Updates

Metadata Management (Felix Hemme and Raegan Wiechert)

  • Entity Management subgroup is starting work again (Oct. 6th meeting was dedicated to them). Group is lead by Jason Kovari and Christie Thomas . Meeting minutes: https://folio-org.atlassian.net/wiki/display/MM/2022-10-06+EMWG+Meeting 
  • Members of different libraries did an API demo: Changing Reference Tables via API, MARC Query API, Bound With Creation, and a demo using MacroExpress
  • Request from multiple institutions to add record HRID and UUID for keyword search. This has been approved by the SIG.
  • At the Oct. 27th meeting there will discussion on searching and display in Inventory

Consortia (Noah Brubaker)

SysOps (Ingolf Kuss) - not available today

  • New Discovery Layer Integrations Group met for the first time on Tuesday
    • About 20 people
    • Discussed VuFind, Blacklight, etc.
    • Patron empowerment issues
    • Edge APIs vs. direct access to Okapi
    • Interest in exposing data to license agreements to the discovery layer
    • Slack channel

Implementers (Ian Walls)

Meeting and discussing issues such as:

  • using browser extensions like Tampermonkey to customize the FOLIO interface (e.g. to remove the display of fields that aren’t used in a library)
  • how libraries are using Loan Types
  • Materials tracking (next time)

Support (Anya Arnold and Debra Howell)

User Management (Maura Byrne)

  • UM-SIG has been doing a lot of work to bring back-end requirements in line with front-end requirements for a User record.  As things currently stand, loading users using APIs does not include any checks to make sure that the user record contains the fields that are required by the UI.  We’ve been addressing JIRA tickets (such as UIU-2651 - Getting issue details... STATUS and MODUSERS-212 - Getting issue details... STATUS ) and working on a Google document to describe where things need to be aligned.

There was also a brief discussion about whether we would like to see an informal “Folio newsletter,” where people could share tips and tricks and point to further reading in the documentation.

App Interaction (Martina Schildt)

  • AI SIG discussed UX/UI topics from implementers - Khalilah presented resulting mock-ups
  • Gathered ideas on how to better coordinate work on long needed features
  • Answered PC questions for SIGs
  • Next topics:
    • Cross-app data sync update and outcome (Oct 19th)
    • UX patterns for common cross-app tasks | e.g. fast add (Oct 24th)

Acquisitions (Dung-Lan Chen)

Topics discussed recently -

  • Reviewed WOLFCon Acquisitions session
  • Discuss the display of EDIFACT export detail on PO and POL. The export history of a purchase order
  • In-depth discussions about workflow of noting Implementers Topics status
  • DIscussed several implementers topics 
  • DIscussed questions from PC for SIGs
  • Discussed “claiming phase 1” and collected feedback/comments from various libraries regarding their claiming needs
  • Review “Order history/change log” feature that was defined a while back

ERM (Martina Tumulla & Martina Schildt)

Open Access (Björn Muschall)

  • From Owen: As I think was already reported the OA app failed to meet the Tech Council criteria for inclusion in a Flower release. This means it won't be in Nolana. I think the question of whether its worth the investment that would be required to meet the TC criteria is one that is not yet agreed

Resource Access (Jana Freytag)

  • Circ log update on deleted item records
  • Internationalization - multilingual implementation - needs
  • RA WolfCon Session went well
  • How to assist with PO work → PO assistance Working group
  • different notice policies for recalled items
  • Bulk edit Requirements for loan due date and hold shelf expiration date

Reporting (Angela Zoss)

SIG conveners

  • SIG conveners are meeting every 8 weeks 
  • Doodle poll for best fitting meeting slot | deadline Oct 21st 2022
  • Currently working on a survey to ask SIG members about options to improve work, communication etc.

Meeting Chat Log

00:02:53	Kristin Martin:	https://wiki.folio.org/display/PC/2022-10-13+Product+Council+Meeting+notes
00:06:26	Kristin Martin:	https://docs.google.com/document/d/1-F613EM2d4pOwgRQobRQyS0k5T2T9RjoprNcfA_NLa0/edit#heading=h.m83ixy3abjcu
00:08:28	Owen Stephens:	There's been a discussion on Slack already on this
00:08:43	Owen Stephens:	https://folio-project.slack.com/archives/C1EPYQKCL/p1665421898850529
00:08:46	Owen Stephens:	In General
00:09:36	Maura Byrne:	I’m on team Quince, because it’s short and easy to spell
00:09:36	Owen Stephens:	Suggested options: Quince, Quercus, Quesnelia, Quaker Ladies
00:10:06	Marc Johnson:	Do folks consider the aesthetics of the flower when choosing the names?
00:10:17	Owen Stephens:	Yes Marc
00:10:17	Alexis Manheim:	Not Quaker Ladies, please
00:10:18	Jana Freytag:	We decided once it should be wild flowers right? :D
00:10:36	Alexis Manheim:	QAL
00:10:40	Jesse Koennecke (he/him):	Quillwort?
00:11:09	Owen Stephens:	Rachel Fadlon said in that chat: The Outreach SIG is happy to make the change. I would suggest that we look for wildflowers (to fit the theme of the rest of this set of A-Z releases) and make sure that the flower is pretty (for logo purposes), although I suppose all flowers are pretty
00:11:19	Kirstin Kemner-Heek:	I prefer the shorter Version!  :-)
00:11:35	Owen Stephens:	Most flowers are wild somewhere Jana 🙂
00:11:36	Dung-Lan Chen:	I prefer the shorter version, too!
00:11:43	Owen Stephens:	KWAL
00:11:50	Marc Johnson:	If folks want to shorten it, they can just call it Q
00:12:09	Owen Stephens:	Suggesting that it's full of gadgets Marc?
00:12:43	Kirstin Kemner-Heek:	Quiller
00:14:00	Marc Johnson:	Owen, bond references work for me :-)
00:14:03	Kristin Martin:	The Product Council recommends that the Outreach SIG research and choose a different Q flower name that is shorter and lacking in a apostrophe. Vote yes or no.
00:14:06	Felix Hemme (ZBW):	Easy to spell! Quebrachobaum ;-)
00:14:31	Marc Johnson:	Folks are likely well aware that I don’t understand the value of the flower names, so I’m very biased in these conversations
00:15:23	Brooks Travis:	Lizards!
00:15:23	Dung-Lan Chen:	Queen's Cup is shorter but with a apostrophe.
00:15:49	anya:	I have had libraries ask if they can suggest names
00:16:40	Tod Olson:	philosophers vs insects?
00:17:28	Peter Murray:	I have the same issue with my Microsoft ergonomic keyboard and the letters rubbing off.
00:17:49	Maura Byrne:	BRB
00:18:58	Maura Byrne:	back
00:20:33	Charlotte Whitt:	HRID and UUID as part of the Keyword search has been implemented, and can be tested in FOLIO Snapshot, and eventually in the the Nolana Bug fest environment
00:22:05	Charlotte Whitt:	Gloria Consoles - is her name
00:22:36	Charlotte Whitt:	Gonzales … sorry - I got the last name misspelled
00:25:45	Tod Olson:	https://wiki.folio.org/display/SYSOPS/Discovery+Integration+Subgroup
00:26:02	Peter Murray:	Thanks, Tod!
00:26:57	Felix Hemme (ZBW):	@Ian, Tampermonkey is interesting. I was asking a question around it in the folio-implementers Slack channel the other day. Will take a look at your notes.
00:27:56	Marc Johnson:	I find it fascinating that folks like the idea of hacking the UI of a system they build and own
00:28:02	Brooks Travis:	I’d love to see a demo of Tampermonkey in action
00:28:24	Brooks Travis:	It’s a question of resources and competencies
00:29:57	Marc Johnson:	In the sense that using tamper monkey is a way to temporarily mitigate constraints we have on rate of development?
00:30:00	Ian Walls:	it's easier for a lot of us to hack away at the DOM with jQuery or vanilla JS than to work with React and then locally host a custom UI
00:30:04	Brooks Travis:	It’s a lot more likely that a library would have local folks capable of implementing something with Tampermonkey than developing something that can be contributed to the project. Not to mention, implementation lag
00:30:58	Marc Johnson:	Ian, I have no doubt it’s easier. 

It’s the philosophy behind it (and the general technical attitude of the library community) that fascinated me.
00:31:00	Felix Hemme (ZBW):	@Marc We own the system, but the schemas and the UI fields are not tied to one institution, but are build around decisions the responsible SIG's have done in the last years. As long as we don't have the ability to customize the UI in the system, doing it on client side seems like a acceptable workaround for me.
00:31:24	Owen Stephens:	TamperMonkey (and similar software like GreaseMonkey and ViolentMonkey) allow for running of custom javascript scripts on any webpage
00:32:30	Owen Stephens:	I suspect that in terms of how they might be used by libraries it would be similar to how libraries have used macro tools like macrorecorder / autohotkey / imacro with other systems
00:32:31	Marc Johnson:	Brooks, sure, I find it interesting that folks value the right to change a system when they don’t have the capabilities use that right
00:32:46	Kristin Martin:	The issue of wanting to customize the UI has come up with the PO/POL in wanting to reduce what fields display.
00:33:31	Marc Johnson:	Felix, I think it’s the willingness to apply this kind of workaround that interests me. 

The idea of hacking my own system is bedazzling to me.
00:34:16	Brooks Travis:	That’s somewhat similar to the “pluggable” users back-end/JIT user provisioning that we discussed at WOLFCon 2020
00:34:17	Dung-Lan Chen:	Yes, we are very interested in the capability of customizing PO/POL UI.
00:36:07	Tod Olson:	One potential scenario for Tampermonkey could be to prototype a change before committing to the development in FOLIO.
00:36:31	Dung-Lan Chen:	ACQ SIG Implementers Topics list - https://folio-org.atlassian.net/wiki/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=5505847
00:37:39	Charlotte Whitt:	I love that idea Tod Olson +1
00:38:39	Marc Johnson:	Prototyping is the use that most makes sense to me
00:39:09	Marc Johnson:	I didn’t really intend to start a long conversation just by letting my idle thoughts run into the chat
00:42:27	Owen Stephens:	As I think was already reported the OA app failed to meet the Tech Council criteria for inclusion in a Flower release. This means it won't be in Nolana. I think the question of whether its worth the investment that would be required to meet the TC criteria is one that is not yet agreed
00:43:19	Charlotte Whitt:	:-( oh I’m sorry to hear that, Owen
00:45:36	Marc Johnson:	Julie Bickle is organising a group to discuss what the desired future state might be in the area of things like contributing modules and what releases are like
00:45:55	Brooks Travis:	I think this is a great discussion to have, Owen.
00:47:26	Owen Stephens:	Agreed Brooks - and I think the group that Julie is organising mentioned by Marc is a good step as well
00:48:56	Martina Schildt:	+1 to Brooks and Owen
00:49:02	Owen Stephens:	A link to Julie’s latest Slack post on that group https://folio-project.slack.com/archives/CTYQZ7PF1/p1665647444604489
00:49:21	Tod Olson:	Foliage is from CalTech
00:50:46	Owen Stephens:	What's the Slack channel?
00:51:09	Angela Zoss:	yes, private
00:51:24	Owen Stephens:	I don't think that's a problem
00:51:33	Owen Stephens:	Product Owners is also locked
00:51:58	Owen Stephens:	I know that we default to Open but I think if it is desired that it should be locked then that's OK
00:52:06	Owen Stephens:	Agreed Kristin
00:52:23	Owen Stephens:	Exactly - sometimes you need a safe space!
00:52:35	Marc Johnson:	For folks interested in open vs. private conversation, the slack analytics are interesting
00:52:47	Angela Zoss:	I think the conveners wiki space is also controlled access? maybe for the host key info?
00:53:19	Martina Schildt:	Good Question - I will check and we can discuss in next SIG convener call
00:56:21	Martina Schildt:	As a reminder for WOLFcon meeting conveners: if you would like to have your meeting moved to your SIG recording space on recordings.openlibraryfoundation.org, please let Peter Murray know.
00:58:35	Owen Stephens:	As an example Folio.org still highlights the UX Prototype link - when we have so many live and test sites to promote!
00:59:16	anya:	Thanks -
01:01:43	Owen Stephens:	I have to step away for a few minutes - apologies
01:10:49	Kristin Martin:	If the system is able to recruit a new individual or way to fund a documentation person, then we have a method to fill roles.
01:11:57	Marc Johnson:	Success is filling the role?
01:13:03	Marc Johnson:	This is why I asked which thing the PO was trying to decide about because that affects how we know if it works
01:14:19	Martina Schildt:	I appreciate the idea
01:14:22	Jesse Koennecke (he/him):	I support this effort.
01:14:25	Maura Byrne:	+1 Alexis
01:14:49	Ian Walls:	+1 to getting more folks engaged and empowered
01:14:57	Sharon Wiles-Young:	I support this work and a succession plan for documentation is good work!
01:15:34	Marc Johnson:	I apologise that my question seeded doubt in whether folks felt supported
01:21:01	Marc Johnson:	Is the roadmap what the community hopes to happen or what is planned to happen?
01:24:45	Brooks Travis:	🧐
01:25:13	Marc Johnson:	Our policies are currently ambiguous as to whether interim module releases are acceptable
01:25:30	Marc Johnson:	Some folks have done them and it’s been ok, others have asked and have had push back
01:27:44	Jana Freytag:	I have to run t another meeting now bye
01:28:51	Brooks Travis:	I think our efforts are probably better focused on making CI/CD a viable deployment model for FOLIO
01:30:11	Peter Murray:	I need to drop to prepare to join another meeting at the top of the hour.  Good to see everyone.
01:31:20	Brooks Travis:	Thanks, everyone. I, too, need to jump.
01:31:21	Kirstin Kemner-Heek:	I need to go to another meeting. Thank you all.
01:31:26	Marc Johnson:	CD is very difficult to attain when not in control of the whole path to production
01:31:33	Owen Stephens:	I have to drop off as well
01:31:56	Martina Schildt:	Need to run, too
01:31:59	Martina Schildt:	Bye