2022-02-03 Product Council Meeting notes
Date
Attendees
- Aaron Trehub, Alexis Manheim, Ann-Marie Breaux (Deactivated),Ā Anya, Brooks Travis, Charlotte Whitt, Christopher Spalding, Felix Hemme, Gang Zhou, Gar Sydnor Ā Hkaplanian, Ian Walls, Jana Freytag, Jesse Koennecke, Karen Newbery, Khalilah Gambrell, Kristin Martin, Martina Schildt, Martina Tumulla, Maura Byrne, Mikhail Fokanov, Owen Stephens, Paul Moeller, Peter Murray, Raegan Wiechert, Sharon Wiles-Young, twliu, Tod Olson, VBarĀ
Discussion items
Time | Item | Who | Notes |
---|---|---|---|
5 min | Announcements | Lotus code release deadline is pushed back a few weeks: Lotus (R1 2022)
National Science Library in Namibia went live on FOLIO last week. | |
Ā 45 mins | Authority Control
Discussion goals:
| Khalilah Gambrell (presenter/demo) Mikhail Fokanov (presenter/demo) | Clarifying that no MARC authority data is being stored; a more generic schema is being used (authority.json) and stored in mod-inventory-storage. When the development team gathers for building the Entities app, this schema could be used as a start.Ā This follows the pattern of mod-inventory-storage and mod-search for instance/holdings records.Ā The intention is not to constrain what the Entities app developers might do, and might point to future work to simplify the functionality now being done in the Inventory app.Ā For Lotus: just authority storage and management; work on "control" is expected to start in Morning Glory. In the course of creating the MARC Authority app, there have been improvements made to the Stripes table view component to make it more accessible to screen readers.Ā John Colburn has been making these updates and working with Zak to get them integrated into other apps as well. Data Import is used to add authority records to the system; there is not a "New" action.Ā This is in line with feedback from the QuickMARC testing libraries. This MARC Authority app needs approval from PC for inclusion in the Lotus release. There are concerns about the process by which a new app was developed and how late in the development process that PC learned about it.Ā For instance, we would want coordination between the group that conceived of the Entities app and this development of the MARC Authorities app.Ā The MM SIG could have been learned about the development of the authority schema and the use of mod-inventory-storage earlier.Ā The PC is interested in reviewing functionality as it is being conceived because it doesn't want to ask TC to perform unnecessary technical reviews.Ā Can the SIG updates be used to raise awareness of this kind of upcoming functionality? Does PC endorse this app being added to FOLIO? No objections from PC members.Ā PC asks TC to perform a technical review of the MARC Authorities app. Taking a step or two back, should the PC be in a position to not accept something that an organization has devoted effort and money into building? |
15 min | Community recruitment: discussion of how to recruit more POs and/or developers | Getting Started for Product Owners has information about product owners. Lucy: There are companies in China that want to join the development effort; can videos and resources be created to help assist that? Can the videos that are on Google Drive now be updated to current? The WOLFcon Asia Pacific Conference is tentatively scheduled April 23, and that would be a good time to share this information and recruit developers. | |
5 min | future topics: | Functional criteria for FOLIO Next week is the SIG update meeting, the template for reports from SIG conveners is here: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1268qg6EoxMwgqnmQkgeUycZkZJQs-No4rJr5xizvamw/edit# |
Chat log
09:33:50 From Ā Khalilah Gambrell Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā Lotus Release timeline: Lotus (R1 2022)
Ā Ā Ā
Ā Ā Feb 11th: Platform core dev freezeĀ
Ā Ā Ā
Ā Ā Feb 18th: Platform complete dev freeze
Ā Ā Ā
Ā Ā March 14th - March 25th: BugfestĀ
Ā Ā Ā
Ā Ā April 18th: Ā Go Live
09:34:11 From Ā Brooks Travis Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā Overall schedule for Lotus has been pushed by a sprint, no change to MG planned, is my understanding
09:34:49 From Ā Khalilah Gambrell Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā Morning Glory timeline: Morning Glory (R2 2022)
Ā Ā Ā
Ā Ā June 3rd: Platform core dev freezeĀ
Ā Ā Ā
Ā Ā June 10: Platform complete dev freeze
Ā Ā Ā
Ā Ā Ā June 24: Module release deadline
Ā Ā Ā
Ā Ā July 4 -15: BugfestĀ
Ā Ā Ā
Ā Ā August 8th: Public Release
09:35:41 From Ā Khalilah Gambrell Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā Lotus timeline: https://folio-org.atlassian.net/wiki/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=5210536
09:35:57 From Ā Khalilah Gambrell Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā Morning Glory timeline: https://folio-org.atlassian.net/wiki/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=5210570
09:42:19 From Ā Brooks Travis Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā Using ElasticSearch
09:42:52 From Ā Brooks Travis Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā It's a JSON authority representation
09:42:57 From Ā Ian Walls Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā so, the practical upshot is that we can make use of Authority records without having to depend on MARC at all
09:42:59 From Ā Felix Hemme (ZBW) Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā https://github.com/folio-org/mod-inventory-storage/blob/master/ramls/authorities/authority.json
09:45:02 From Ā Harry Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā +1 Ian
09:45:36 From Ā Peter Murray Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā Fascinating decision!
09:45:41 From Ā Ian Walls Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā +10 to Spitfire for building it this way
09:47:01 From Ā Ian Walls Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā The Future of Libraries is MARC-less!
09:49:55 From Ā Brooks Travis Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā Data import integration and ES
09:51:35 From Ā Charlotte Whitt Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā Eventually we hope also to use Elasticsearch in Users and many more apps, but that do not mean that we will store Users in mod-inventory-storage?
09:53:50 From Ā Ian Walls Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā from a SysOps perspective, it's great not to have yet another module to install and connect.
09:55:26 From Ā Aaron Trehub Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā Have to leave for another meeting...
09:57:31 From Ā Charlotte Whitt Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā Entity Management Vision written by the working group lead by Jason Kovari (Cornell): https://folio-org.atlassian.net/wiki/display/MM/Entities+App%3A+Vision
09:58:15 From Ā Charlotte Whitt Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā Sounds good, Vince
09:58:55 From Ā Owen Stephens Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā It might be an interesting thing to do to compare that vision to what is delivered by this work - as I think the work there was focussed on authority, even though as a vision it wanted to consider broader impact of entity management
10:00:31 From Ā Brooks Travis Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā No control
10:00:50 From Ā Brooks Travis Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā Just storage and management
10:02:22 From Ā Owen Stephens Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā Iām afraid I have to leave the meeting for a bit - Iāll catch up with the demo later thanks Khalilah
10:08:39 From Ā Felix Hemme (ZBW) Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā Thanks Harry for the clarification
10:08:41 From Ā Peter Murray Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā Reflecting on what you said earlier, I note there is no "New" action in the MARC Authority App.
10:14:20 From Ā Brooks Travis Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā Is MARC Authority app only searching records of source=MARC?
10:14:30 From Ā Brooks Travis Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā At present
10:15:17 From Ā Peter Murray Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā In the JSON schema, there is a field that indicates whether it is "MARC" or "FOLIO". Ā I think you said we don't have the notion of a "FOLIO" authority record at the moment, so there isn't a record being stored as that native JSON schema, right?
10:15:53 From Ā Brooks Travis Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā There's an API for that, isn't there
10:16:00 From Ā Brooks Travis Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā ?
10:16:26 From Ā Ian Walls Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā we do have a FOLIO Authority record schema, which is what is searched and all, but there is no front-end for editing that record directly.
10:16:35 From Ā Felix Hemme (ZBW) Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā Yes, you can POST to this storage according to https://s3.amazonaws.com/foliodocs/api/mod-inventory-storage/authorities.html#
10:16:55 From Ā Peter Murray Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā Ah, fascinating...thanks, Ian and Felix.
10:17:57 From Ā Ian Walls Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā I look forward to editing FOLIO-native records at some point in the future, but it doesn't sound like that was the driving factor for this development
10:18:30 From Ā Peter Murray Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā Yes, that makes sense.
10:19:24 From Ā Peter Murray Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā I wonder about that, too...just calling the app "Authority".
10:19:39 From Ā Peter Murray Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā That would better set the expectations for what is to come.
10:22:22 From Ā Brooks Travis Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā To me, I think the current naming makes more sense. This was built MARC-first, and it could, frankly, be MARC-only while we wait on the entity management WG that could result in a wholly new UI/set of UI apps that could potentially replace it.
10:23:24 From Ā Peter Murray Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā So maybe the "MARC Authorities" app would go away when the "Entities" app overtakes it?
10:23:31 From Ā Brooks Travis Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā I, for one, think that this is great work.
10:23:47 From Ā Tod Olson Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā ++Brooks
10:25:30 From Ā Ian Walls Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā Falcon +10
10:25:56 From Ā Tod Olson Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā Thank you KG for the demo and discussion. This is really interesting. Nice way to build toward a non-MARC-centric future.
10:29:54 From Ā Brooks Travis Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā I also feel like I heard about this for months in various fora. It was included in the roadmap back in November.
10:31:03 From Ā Brooks Travis Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā Isn't that outside the scope of the SIGs, though? The technical implementation?
10:31:43 From Ā Peter Murray Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā In an app-based model, we also need to expect flexibility in how ideas for apps come about.
10:32:11 From Ā Ian Walls Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā Peter++
10:32:12 From Ā Brooks Travis Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā I would move to approve this for inclusion. It's functionality that has been requested and highly-ranked by existing and potential adopters. It significantly enhances market fit and has high strategic impact for the project.
10:32:23 From Ā Ann-Marie Breaux Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā the quickMARC, Data Import, and Entity Management groups are all subgroups of MM SIG
10:32:36 From Ā Brooks Travis Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā ++Ann-Marie
10:33:21 From Ā Peter Murray Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā Owen++ "we can move as an agile community"
10:34:16 From Ā Ian Walls Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā I would argue that we don't need permission to move forward with particular developments, so much as consent as to whether to include it in the standard community build
10:35:57 From Ā Owen Stephens Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā I agree with that Ian - but this is my point about the existing modules. They are already part of the community build and thereās no process or option (as it stands) to do something different to that
10:39:39 From Ā Owen Stephens Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā That makes sense to me Ian - I definitely think being clear about how this works (whether itās this model or something else) is the right way to go
10:40:24 From Ā Ian Walls Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā and I would agree that there needs to be a mechanism for making sure an already-accepted set of code is continuing to meet the articulated needs.
10:40:57 From Ā Ian Walls Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā this could cover both new areas of functionality as well as the necessities of maintenance
10:42:19 From Ā Owen Stephens Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā Thatās a huge statement to finish on!
10:42:58 From Ā Karen Newbery Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā But Harry, didn't you argue against that very statement regarding the LDP?
10:44:07 From Ā Kristin Martin Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā That has been part of the discussion of the Scope-Criteria group.
10:44:08 From Ā Harry Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā Karen, I did not..
10:44:21 From Ā Felix Hemme (ZBW) Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā Thank you Khalilah. Bye
10:44:59 From Ā Harry Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā There is no question that LDP is critical to many libraries.
10:45:41 From Ā Harry Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā The question is why is PC even making judgement calls as to what is important or what isnāt.
10:46:19 From Ā Harry Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā And taking that into account with our current and unscalable release process implies that we need a major change.
10:46:52 From Ā Ian Walls Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā Harry and Kristin, I would love to continue this conversation in Slack. Ā would y'all be willing to pick this up in #folio-product-council?
10:47:29 From Ā Ian Walls Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā sorry, not just Kristin, also Karen (tracing chat backlog). Ā also, everyone interested
10:49:37 From Ā Harry Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā I think so, if I have time.
10:51:12 From Ā Ian Walls Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā of course. Ā I just think this is a very important topic for the community to talk about as we move forward
10:52:03 From Ā Kristin Martin Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā A small group of us is considering this topic and I think we'll be ready for a fuller discussion with PC shortly. I don't see this as the end!
10:52:37 From Ā Harry Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā +100 Kristin & Ian!
10:53:13 From Ā Karen Newbery Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā Thanks, Kristin!
10:55:04 From Ā Peter Murray Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā SIG convener update document> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1268qg6EoxMwgqnmQkgeUycZkZJQs-No4rJr5xizvamw/edit#
10:55:50 From Ā Brooks Travis Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā Thanks, everyone!
10:55:53 From Ā Karen Newbery Ā to Ā Everyone:
Ā Ā Stay safe and warm!