2023-12-07 Metadata Management Meeting notes
- Raegan Wiechert
- Christine Schultz-Richert
- Lynne Fors
Date
Attendees
~30
Note taker: Laura Daniels, Lynne Fors, Alissa Hafele, Natascha Owens
Recordings
Recordings of meetings can be found in the Metadata_Management_SIG > Recordings folder on AWS from 2022 onwards: https://recordings.openlibraryfoundation.org/folio/metadata-management-sig/
Discussion items
| Announcements | Today in the PC: Follow up on Entity Management and MM SIG discussion Question from App Interaction: any use cases for rich text/html in any elements in Inventory? (Laura has put the question in Slack as well) Ann-Marie is retiring at the end of 2023 after 40+ years in libraries. Ryan Taylor is taking over much of the work A-M was leading. | |
| Searching LCCNs | Christine Schultz-Richert | UIIN-2245 "Implement normalized search options for LCCN identifers (bib/instance records)" (note: LCCN = control numbers, e.g. what's recording in MARC 010) Questions:
Has anyone consulted LoC? Yes, there have been conversations with them but they want this to meet community's needs as well. Note that we'll be adding an identifier type for 010$z as Invalid or Cancelled LCCN as of Quesnelia, similar to what we did for 035$z a while back Re: leading/trailing spaces, related general issue: UXPROD-3473: Inventory: Strip leading, trailing, and double spaces out of data in some elements (instance, holding, item) For new "LCCN, normalized" search option - new requirements page added: LCCN search updates (MARC authority & Inventory) Charlotte notes that search consistency across apps is challenging as some apps use PostgreSQL, while Inventory/quickMARC use mod-search/ElasticSearch |
| Call number searching | Christine Schultz-Richert | What elements of the call number need to be searchable? Postponed until next week |
| PC update | 2023-12-07 Product Council Meeting Agenda and Notes Announcements: No announcements. Report from Hygiene subgroup: Accomplished: Decreasing the PC's meeting time from 90 to 60 minutes. Cleaned up the list of future meeting topics. Important to keep up with this work going forward. A new list with Community topics for PC has been created. Everyone can add topics to this list. The list can be aligned with the similar page with Topics for SIG conveners. How to better accommodate a meeting time, which also users in Australia will be able to attend. The PC working group suggest a quarterly meeting time for the PC either Australia-US or Australia-Europe. Potential a larger initiative, where the SIGs also will align around these meeting times. Follow up on Entity Management and MM SIG discussion: The MM-SIG had a meeting on 11/30/2023. The MM-SIG is aligned around that EM belongs under the MM-SIG. A new Linked Data working group was formed, with Laura Daniels as initial convener. Laura has announced a call for participants. Open for every one to attend. If the status of the EMWG later need to change into a SIG, then there is precedence for this, like the ERM SIG, who started out as a WG. The MM-SIG conveners will help Laura straighten out some of the channels we currently have for EM discussions. MM-SIG finds that the reporting back for subgroups is not working that well. The regular updates will be re-introduced. An idea for having a Inventory Overview Committee to be established. This idea need some more work. For MM-SIG Inventory and quickMARC is key areas, incl. mod-search related to Inventory Search. Re. SRS was developed without active participation by SMEs. This is an area, where the MM-SIG will spend some more time. Data Import and Data Export can stay under MM-SIG or can be a SIG on it's own. Jenifer mentioned that Data Export is hibernating. How to move forward on Data Import, then this will be discussed at the Data Import Lab session later today. Bulk edit is managing meta data / systems data from all app. Jenn Colt mentioned that there is a Data Import user support group + slack channel. Having more SMEs involved as Co-PO would be a way to share the work load on not just Data Import, but also Inventory, quickMARC etc. There is a general sense that the MM-SIG has been mainly informative SIG for quite some time. The development is happening in 'a black box'. Felix could see that having a SME Co-PO then topics being worked on, could better surface, and be included in the meeting planning. Decisions need to be reported and shared - that would ease the understanding on, what new work is planned. The new work happening on Inventory, is mainly centered about the LoC requirements. Jenifer suggested an Inventory Hygiene working group. Recommended: listen to recording of PC meeting if interested in this discussion |
Chat
11:32:05 From Felix Hemme to Everyone:
Today's agenda: https://folio-org.atlassian.net/wiki/x/-0FH
11:35:24 From Laura Daniels to Everyone:
cheers to doing other things than work, work, and work
11:35:27 From Jennifer Eustis to Everyone:
Congratulations Ann-Marie! You'll be missed.
11:35:34 From Jenn Colt to Everyone:
Reacted to "cheers to doing othe..." with 💯
11:35:40 From Alissa Hafele to Everyone:
Congratulations, Ann-Marie!
11:35:43 From Alissa Hafele to Everyone:
Reacted to "cheers to doing othe..." with 💯
11:35:50 From Christie Thomas (she/her) to Everyone:
Congratulations!
11:35:59 From Jackie Magagnosc to Everyone:
Reacted to "cheers to doing othe..." with 💯
11:36:04 From Kalli Mathios to Everyone:
Congratulations!
11:36:24 From Ros, Amanda L to Everyone:
Congratulations!
11:36:41 From Laura Daniels to Everyone:
we may have been annoyed with DI, but I've always really appreciated you and your many contributions
11:36:49 From Ros, Amanda L to Everyone:
Reacted to "cheers to doing othe..." with 💯
11:36:50 From Charlotte Whitt to Everyone:
Congratulations 🌸
11:36:52 From Jennifer Eustis to Everyone:
Reacted to "we may have been ann..." with 💯
11:36:53 From Alissa Hafele to Everyone:
Reacted to "we may have been ann..." with 💯
11:36:54 From Christie Thomas (she/her) to Everyone:
Reacted to "we may have been ann..." with 💯
11:36:56 From Lynne Fors to Everyone:
Reacted to "we may have been ann..." with 💯
11:37:00 From Ros, Amanda L to Everyone:
Reacted to "we may have been ann..." with 💯
11:37:00 From scolglaz to Everyone:
Reacted to "Congratulations Ann-..." with 💯
11:37:01 From Amanda Scott to Everyone:
Congratulations!
11:37:02 From Jenn Colt to Everyone:
Reacted to "we may have been ann..." with 💯
11:37:08 From Jenn Colt to Everyone:
Congratulations!!!
11:37:37 From Felix Hemme to Everyone:
All the best for you, Ann-Marie
11:37:48 From Ann-Marie Breaux to Everyone:
Thank you so much, everybody!
11:37:51 From Felix Hemme to Everyone:
Reacted to "we may have been ann..." with 💯
11:39:14 From Lynne Fors to Everyone:
Agreed!
11:39:21 From Ryan Tamares - Stanford Law Library to Everyone:
Reacted to "Agreed!" with ➕
11:39:24 From Ros, Amanda L to Everyone:
Reacted to "Agreed!" with ➕
11:40:23 From Jennifer Eustis to Everyone:
maybe a hyphen
11:40:26 From scolglaz to Everyone:
isn't there an empty space at the front
11:40:35 From Christie Thomas (she/her) to Everyone:
Some have hyphens, right?
11:40:52 From Jenn Colt to Everyone:
The spaces!!! I don’t understand them
11:41:01 From scolglaz to Everyone:
Reacted to "The spaces!!! I don’..." with 💯
11:41:11 From Ann-Marie Breaux to Everyone:
Me either - the spaces have always driven me crazy
11:41:14 From scolglaz to Everyone:
Drive me nuts
11:41:20 From Lynne Fors to Everyone:
Reacted to "The spaces!!! I don’..." with 💯
11:41:28 From Jenn Colt to Everyone:
Reacted to "Me either - the spac..." with 💯
11:42:11 From Jenn Colt to Everyone:
Confusion with oclc?
11:45:04 From Lloyd (Marmot Library Network) to Everyone:
Aren't there hyphens in old LCCNs?
11:45:05 From Lisa F. (TAMU Cat) to Everyone:
Sorry, I don't agree with remove internal spaces in LCCNs.
11:46:53 From Jennifer Eustis to Everyone:
This page might be helpful for reference, https://www.loc.gov/marc/lccn_structure.html. It was last updated in 2006 though
11:47:08 From Lisa F. (TAMU Cat) to Everyone:
https://www.loc.gov/marc/bibliographic/bd010.html
11:47:45 From Jamie Jesanis (they/them) to Everyone:
is this just how the search engine treats the number and not how the data is stored? as far as I know, you don't have to add leading zeroes when searching in OCLC
11:47:51 From Lynne Fors to Everyone:
Searching LCCN without the leading alpha characters works in catalog.loc.gov
11:48:01 From Laura Daniels to Everyone:
Reacted to "is this just how the..." with ➕
11:48:05 From Felix Hemme to Everyone:
Laura makes a good point. Some websites display spaces, but when you copy the data they are not included because there was only some formatting applied.
11:49:15 From Lloyd (Marmot Library Network) to Everyone:
https://www.konsortswd.de/wp-content/uploads/McCallum_PID2012.pdf
11:50:00 From Felix Hemme to Everyone:
Reacted to "https://www.konsorts..." with ❤️
11:50:52 From Ryan Tamares - Stanford Law Library to Everyone:
Reacted to "https://www.konsorts..." with 👍🏽
11:53:26 From Amanda Scott to Everyone:
In Orchid, searching for an LCCN in Keyword or Identifier (All) retrieves an LCCN with or without leading spaces.
11:54:00 From Felix Hemme to Everyone:
@Ann-Marie Breaux Yes, we can do all that because we are not searching the records directly, but the Open Search index that can contain the data in normalized form, however we decide the normalization should look like.
11:54:13 From Amanda Scott to Everyone:
That is, including the leading spaces or omitting them retrieves a record.
11:54:24 From Ann-Marie Breaux to Everyone:
Reacted to "That is, including t..." with ✅
11:54:27 From Laura Daniels to Everyone:
Replying to "That is, including t..."
that is what I'd expect
11:55:36 From Ann-Marie Breaux to Everyone:
Replying to "That is, including t..."
Exactly, Amanda - don't require the user to know whether they need to input spaces or not. And retrieve the record regardless of whether the input search request has spaces, punctuation, or not.
11:55:44 From Lynne Fors to Everyone:
Reacted to "That is, including t..." with ✅
11:55:47 From scolglaz to Everyone:
Is this search a limited search of its own in the dropdown? Or also in about Identifier (All)? Or is it going to be included with the KW search?
11:55:51 From Laura Daniels to Everyone:
Reacted to "Exactly, Amanda - do..." with ➕
11:58:44 From Ann-Marie Breaux to Everyone:
For me, the most common search case in my Acq days was typing in the LCCN from the CIP data on the title page verso
11:59:26 From Laura Daniels to Everyone:
Reacted to "For me, the most com..." with ✅
12:00:33 From Christie Thomas (she/her) to Everyone:
What will a normalized LCCN search get us versus an LCCN search?
12:01:29 From Laura Daniels to Everyone:
Sara makes a good point, consistency is really good UX
12:02:39 From Lynne Fors to Everyone:
Reacted to "Sara makes a good po..." with 💯
12:03:55 From Jackie Magagnosc to Everyone:
Reacted to "Sara makes a good po..." with 💯
12:05:59 From scolglaz to Everyone:
For the Query search I use * in all positions!
12:06:29 From scolglaz to Everyone:
example: holdings.electronicAccess.uri="*https://dx.doi.org/10*1093/*"
12:06:38 From Lisa F. (TAMU Cat) to Everyone:
Just for fun, I just looked at OCLC and tried a few LCCN. There are two searches: 1. lccn phrase which includes prefixes and spaces and gets the exact hit and 2. lccn: which just searches the numerical part, and then gets hits on multiple titles where the number string was part of the lccn.
12:07:42 From Charlotte Whitt to Everyone:
Good point Lynne.
12:08:10 From Charlotte Whitt to Everyone:
Maybe if the MM-SIG could review the LC requirements and check if we are all aligned
12:09:40 From Ann-Marie Breaux to Everyone:
Note that we'll be adding an identifier type for 010$z as Invalid or Cancelled LCCN as of Quesnelia, similar to what we did for 035$z a while back
12:12:05 From Thomas Trutt to Everyone:
You want them to run the trim command
12:12:12 From scolglaz to Everyone:
+1 to the trailing spaces being ignored!
12:12:30 From Lynne Fors to Everyone:
Reacted to "+1 to the trailing s..." with ➕
12:13:50 From Charlotte Whitt to Everyone:
See also the more general feature: UXPROD-3473: Inventory: Strip leading, trailing, and double spaces out of data in some elements (instance, holding, item)
12:14:02 From Laura Daniels to Everyone:
Reacted to "See also the more ge..." with ➕
12:25:22 From Jenn Colt to Everyone:
Reacted to "See also the more ge..." with ➕
12:25:42 From Felix Hemme to Everyone:
@Rita Albrecht In WinIBW searching CBS for a record with LCN m2011312476, when you search "2011312476" or "*2011312476" you want find a result.
12:25:54 From Felix Hemme to Everyone:
Replying to "@Rita Albrecht In Wi..."
*won't
12:26:06 From Charlotte Whitt to Everyone:
+ 1 Lisa
12:27:34 From Rita Albrecht to Everyone:
Replying to "@Rita Albrecht In Wi..."
Ich weiß nicht, ob das bei uns auch so ist. Es kann sein, dass wir bei einem Blank zwischen dem Buchstaben und den Zahlen tatsächlich mehrere Varianten indexieren. Wir sind da sehr großzügig!
12:27:56 From Charlotte Whitt to Everyone:
I agree with you Laura