2024-03-04 Meeting notes



Discussion items

1 minScribeAll

Florian Gleixner is next, followed by Jeremy Huff

Reminder:  Please copy/paste the Zoom chat into the notes.  If you miss it, this is saved along with the meeting recording, but having it here has benefits.

5-10 minLiaison Updates
  • CC: Maccabee Levine
    • No CC meeting this week.
  • PC: Tod Olson (was unable to attend, additional info from anyone else?)
    • Continuation of prioritization process, being piloted in Acquisitions SIG.
  • RMS Group: Jakub Skoczen 
    • Moveng the extension for new modules evaluation to the 18. is OK
  • Security Team: Craig McNally 
    • No important updates - business as usual
  • Tri-council Application Formalization: Jenn Colt 
    • Continuing to work on questions, available in the tri-council channel for discussion
5-10 minTCR Board Review


UI Serials management Maccabee Levine:

  • Meeting with dev Team at Friday. Dev Team is working through the issues.
  • Potential License incompatibilities are detected, not all in module own software but also in stripes.
    • A list with probably not compatible licenses can be delivered
    • Tod Olson sometimes depends if we distribute the software or if we use is
    • Craig McNally probably solved issues, maybe Zak Burke or other already sorted this out
  • Owen Stephens most will be fixable until March 18. but few will need more time. The dev team will do the best to fix it.

MOD-Serials Ingolf Kuss:

  • Owen Stephens Upgrade to Grails 6 is ongoing, some issues are detected. Will be fully done at final release of Quesnelia
  • Integration tests are missing: Owen Stephens is in work, Update at wednesday.
  • Jeremy Huff discussion how to handle requirements on integration/unit tests.

5 minUpcoming MeetingsAll
  •  - Ramsons OST:  Accepted → Active
  •  - Regular TC meeting
  •  - Dedicated Discussion - Topic TBD
  •  - Regular TC meeting
  •  - Dedicated Discussion - Topic TBD
  •  - Regular TC meeting
  •  - Dedicated Discussion - Topic TBD
10-15 min

Technical Council Sub Groups Updates


Quick updates only.  If we can't find volunteers for groups, we'll need to add the topic to our backlog and address it during dedicated discussion sessions.

Go Programming Language: Some comments from Julian Ladisch

Distributed vs. Centraliced: Moved to Public review. Subgroup closed

TCR Process Improvements: Maccabee Levine and Jenn Colt will talk about suggestions for the release process at the next release stakeholder meeting. Subgroup can be wrapped up then.

10 minRFCs


  • Application Formalization RFC
  • Go Programming Language for Backend Development RFC
  • Distributed vs Centralized Configuration RFC - is in public Review

RFC Process Improvements:

  • We need another RFC to update the metadata retroactively to reflect the new or adjusted statuses. - Jenn Colt
1 minDecision LogAll

Standing agenda item... is there anything in the decision log requiring attention? 

  • ...
Time Permitting

Officially Supported Technologies (OST)


Standing agenda item to review/discuss any requested or required changes to officially supported technology lists

  • Check in on progress... does anything else require attention?
  • Next Important Milestone:  Review Ramsons (1st party dependencies) and move from ACCEPTED → ACTIVE by   
    • Maybe we should aim to start looking at this on   so we have time for discussion/adjustments
  • Other todo items: 
    • Review policies and reasoning on page with intent to vote on approval (Sunflower)


On the Quesnelia OST Page:

  • Comment on Groovy2 Marc Johnson Groovy version depends on Grails. This combination is not possible. Grails 6 needs Groovy 3. Switch the OST Page to Groovy 3 or just remove the version.
    • Version removed and replaced with a comment suggested by Tod Olson
  • Comment on Folio-spring-base Version. Changed.

Same changes done on Ramsons page.

NAZoom Chat

00:04:33 Maccabee Levine: The More You Know! (TM)
00:05:15 Tod Olson: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casimir_Pulaski_Day
00:06:12 Jakub Skoczen: Guys, I have headset issues
00:20:44 Marc Johnson: I think the word unit is probably misleading in the criteria

I took it to mean tests within the module repository
00:22:01 Marc Johnson: Many of the modules (at least, pretty much all of the RMB modules) don’t have classical unit tests
00:22:07 Ingolf Kuss: I would like to have this as a Topic Backlog to make it easier for future Reviewers to decide,
00:26:46 Tod Olson: Here are the meeting notes for Tri-Council this Thursday: https://folio-org.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/CC/pages/53150568/2024-03-07+Tri-Council+Meeting+notes
00:27:03 Craig McNally: Reacted to "Here are the meeting..." with 👍
00:36:11 Tod Olson: How about:
Groovy (version determined by version of Grails, below)
00:42:15 Ingolf Kuss: Did we fix the folio-spring-base.version 7.4 issue (= a version that does not exist) ?

Topic Backlog

Decision Log ReviewAll

Review decisions which are in progress.  Can any of them be accepted?  rejected?

Translation SubgroupAllSince we're having trouble finding volunteers for a subgroup, maybe we can make progress during a dedicated discussion session?
Communicating Breaking ChangesAllSince we're having trouble finding volunteers for a subgroup, maybe we can make progress during a dedicated discussion session?
Officially Supported Technologies - UpkeepAll

Previous Notes:

  • A workflow for these pages. When do they transition from one state to another. Do we even need statuses at all ?

Stripes architecture group has some questions about the Poppy release.

Zak: A handshake between developers, dev ops and the TC. Who makes that decision and how do we pass along that knowledge ? E.g. changes in Nodes and in the UI boxes. How to communicate this ? We have a large number of teams, all have to be aware of it.  TC should be alerted that changes are happening. We have a couple of dedicated channels for that. Most dev ops have subscribed to these channels. How can dev ops folk raise issues to the next level of community awareness ? There hasn't been a specific piece of TC to move that along.

Craig: There is a fourth group, "Capacity Planning" or "Release Planning". Slack is the de facto communication channel.  There are no objections to using Slack. An example is the Java 17 RFC. 

Craig: The TC gets it on the agenda and we will discuss it. The TC gets the final say.

Marc Johnson: We shouldn’t use the DevOps Channel. The dev ops folks have made it clear that it should only be used for support requests made to them.

Jakub: Our responsibility is to avoid piling up technical debt.

Marc: Some set of people have to actually make the call. Who lowers the chequered flag ?

Craig: It needs to ultimately come to the TC at least for awareness. There is a missing piece. Capacity Planning needs to provide input here. 

Marc: Stakeholders / Capacity Planning could make that decision. Who makes the decision ? Is it the government or is it some parts of the body ?

Marc: the developers community, the dev ops community and sys ops are involved. For example the Spring Framework discussion or the Java 17 discussion. But it was completely separate to the TC decision. It is a coordination and communication effort.

Marc: Maybe the TC needs to let go that they are the decision makers so that they be a moderating group.

Jakub: I agree with Marc. But we are not a system operating group. Dependency management should be in the responsibility of Release management. There are structures in the project for that.

Jason Root: I agree with Jakub and with Marc also. Policies should drive operational/release/support aspects of Folio.

Jason Root: If the idea of “support” is that frameworks are supported, then of course the project should meet that.

Marc Johnson
Some group needs to inform OleksAii when a relevant policy event occurs.
These documents effectively ARE the manifestation of the policy.

Craig: This is a topic for the next Monday session.

Craig to see if Oleksii Petrenko could join us to discuss the process for updating the officially supported technologies lists.

Dev Documentation VisibilityAll

Possible topic/activity for a Wednesday session:


  • Ideas for the type of developer-facing documentation we think would be most helpful for new developers
  • How we might bring existing documentation up to date and ensure it's consistent 
  • etc.

Action Items

TC members to review policy guidance in Ramsons OST page and provide feedback