2023-09-06 Meeting notes: Review discussion around container records

Date

06 Sep 2023

Housekeeping

• Convener and notes Martina Schildt 
• Next meeting: 11 Sep 2023 

Discussion items

1. Container records 
   1. Discuss existing functionality related to package POLs (Dennis Bridges, Sara Colglazier, ALL)
   2. Discuss whether all use casese are covered

Minutes

Documents and links

• Charlotte’s presentation from DC https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/17gjJOUCJbMPOw2ficYsLtiaKMHv3ivvRh7Kiwyhd7QI/edit#slide=id.p
• App Interaction: Modeled workflows with and without container record: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1r7olPeix2TaS-ZXJZtoW4a7w_-Qo79NancIV0LdlBXc/edit?usp=sharing (Martina)
• Google drive folder: https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1Xn-agNxtZ83E9fmANqBUBRxiuwIMkJk1
• Local Package Record Subgroup | Wiki space
• Local Packages in Inventory (UIIN-155)
• Use cases for containers: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1KZ3ejxrlw5TlP5mmBSHf3rJjmI_00VWpZwxqTywjgDU/edit#gid=0

Use cases

• Sara Colglazier demoes how she is using the package POL
• Proposal: rename package POL in container POL
  • Owen in chat: I think “container” POL is a good term here based on seeing Sara present on how she uses it at the ACQ SIG last week
• Laura: So if we wanted to export data from all the titles associated with the Package POL, or if we wanted to make some update to all the associated titles, would there be a way to do that? I think I'm asking if we can easily get a list of UUIDs or hrids for all associated title instance records?
  • Jennifer in chat: That would be great to get a title list with the uuids. I'm thinking this could be great for gifts where donors occasionally ask for a list of what has been cataloged.
• You can add titles to the package in the order, but you cannot remove a title once it has been added
• All titles can be brought up in Inventory and from there the title list can be exported
• The UUID is available in Receiving, though
• Laura in chat: FOLIO generating/storing those "hooks" for us is exactly the functionality I was hoping for from Container records.
• Jennifer in chat: It would be great to take actions on the container. Like for instance if all the streaming videos in the container have an end license date, that information can be put at the container level and then this could hook into a dashboard to alert the user when those videos' license end.
• Lisa in chat: I would really like to see a filter or search by package name in the POL, which would display all of the POL titles linked to the package.
• Martina: if we generally think  the container POL / package POL solve the use cases, then we could start adding requirements 
• titles that have been added cannot be deleted again - workaround: re-link title
• we need to think about: do we want to be able to delete? Shouldn't we record what has been ordered?
  • on the other hand, there are use cases where a user needs the option to delete - e.g. if user made a mistake
• but we should be careful in the way we support it - we should record swappages
• Special collections might be an example where we still need containers
• Owen in chat: Its a bit of a shame that we couldn’t have the agreements and orders functionality overlap here
• Maura advocates for a gap analysis to maybe extend Agreements funtionality to orders | +1 Charlotte, +1 Martina
  • definitely needed: keep implemented institutions in the loop to not "destroy" anything
• needed functionality: add data, make notes (as user can do in Agreements)
• To Do: come back and look at linking / realtionship options between Agreements and Orders
• Outcome so far:
  • existing conatiner use cases are solved by package POL
  • Special collections might be an example where we still need containers in Inventory
  • extensions might be needed for package POL
  • wish: rename package POL to conatiner POL

Next steps

• Martina Schildt creat a wiki page to collect missing package POL functionality / container functionality
• Martina Schildt Schedule meeting: Continuation on container records - needed: Owen Stephens to demo related Agreements functionality - not before 25 Sep 2023 
• Martina Schildt to list issues that are still open or in draft for the container or for enhancing the Order Package?

Chat

18:01:00 From Martina Schildt | VZG To Everyone:
    Link to our Agenda for today: 2023-09-06 Meeting notes: Review discussion around container records
18:02:42 From Charlotte Whitt To Everyone:
    brb
18:04:10 From Charlotte Whitt To Everyone:
    back
18:06:15 From Owen Stephens To Everyone:
    Save and Keep Editing is already an option in QuickMarc, although whether it works effectively seems to be a question
18:09:09 From scolglaz To Everyone:
    Excellent!
18:11:36 From Owen Stephens To Everyone:
    I think “container” POL is a good term here based on seeing Sara present on how she uses it at the ACQ SIG last week
18:12:43 From Jennifer Eustis To Everyone:
    We still can't delete those package titles … right?
18:13:34 From Martina Schildt | VZG To Everyone:
    Replying to "We still can't delet..."
    
    That is correct, but is already forwarded as a requirement in ACQ SIG.
18:13:44 From Jennifer Eustis To Everyone:
    Reacted to "That is correct, but..." with 💯
18:14:11 From Owen Stephens To Everyone:
    Replying to "We still can't delet..."
    
    Sorry - not sure I understand. Deleting a title in the package, or deleting the package title (title of the package?)
18:14:43 From Jennifer Eustis To Everyone:
    Replying to "We still can't delet..."
    
    You can add titles to the package in the order. You just can't remove a title once it has been added.
18:15:03 From Owen Stephens To Everyone:
    Replying to "We still can't delet..."
    
    Thanks
18:15:13 From Laura Daniels To Everyone:
    So if we wanted to export data from all the titles associated with the Package POL, or if we wanted to make some update to all the associated titles, would there be a way to do that? I think I'm asking if we can easily get a list of UUIDs or hrids for all associated title instance records?
18:15:30 From Charlotte Whitt To Everyone:
    Awesome Sara - love the link to the almost 9000 titles in Inventory
18:17:39 From Jennifer Eustis To Everyone:
    Replying to "So if we wanted to e..."
    
    That would be great to get a title list with the uuids. I'm thinking this could be great for gifts where donors occasionally ask for a list of what has been cataloged.
18:21:54 From Laura Daniels To Everyone:
    FOLIO generating/storing those "hooks" for us is exactly the functionality I was hoping for from Container records.
18:23:14 From Jennifer Eustis To Everyone:
    It would be great to take actions on the container. Like for instance if all the streaming videos in the container have an end license date, that information can be put at the container level and then this could hook into a dashboard to alert the user when those videos' license end.
18:23:28 From Laura Daniels To Everyone:
    Reacted to "It would be great to..." with ➕
18:23:30 From Lisa Smith - Mich State To Everyone:
    I would really like to see a filter or search by package name in the POL, which would display all of the POL titles linked to the package.
18:23:43 From Maura Byrne To Everyone:
    Reacted to "It would be great to..." with ➕
18:24:10 From Martina Schildt | VZG To Everyone:
    Reacted to "It would be great to..." with ➕
18:25:31 From Charlotte Whitt To Everyone:
    So ’tragic’ that deletion of an instance is to be solved by doing an overlay 😔
18:25:32 From Laura Daniels To Everyone:
    Is it possible for one Inventory title to be associated with more than one POL?
18:25:45 From Jennifer Eustis To Everyone:
    Reacted to "Is it possible for o..." with 👍
18:25:52 From Maura Byrne To Everyone:
    Reacted to "Is it possible for o..." with 👍
18:26:05 From Jennifer Eustis To Everyone:
    Replying to "Is it possible for o..."
    
    It can. We see that here at the Five Colleges
18:26:11 From Martina Schildt | VZG To Everyone:
    Reacted to "Is it possible for o..." with 👍
18:27:02 From Laura Daniels To Everyone:
    Replying to "Is it possible for o..."
    
    Great, thank you.
18:28:52 From Owen Stephens To Everyone:
    I definitely think that we should support the need for the content of the container to change
18:28:57 From Owen Stephens To Everyone:
    I’m not saying we shouldn't
18:29:06 From Owen Stephens To Everyone:
    I just think it should be done in a way that is transparent
18:29:12 From Owen Stephens To Everyone:
    And keep good records over time
18:29:18 From Laura Daniels To Everyone:
    hear, hear, Sara
18:29:35 From Owen Stephens To Everyone:
    That’s exactly what we try to do in Agreements with agreement lines - they can expire within an ongoing agreement
18:30:03 From Maura Byrne To Everyone:
    Sara, it sounds like you want a “manager key” for deleting things from the order.
18:33:07 From Lisa Smith - Mich State To Everyone:
    Many times, we need to 'move' the titles to and from various packages.
18:33:14 From Jennifer Eustis To Everyone:
    Reacted to "Many times, we need ..." with 💯
18:33:25 From Owen Stephens To Everyone:
    Again - that’s exactly how we design it in Agreements
18:33:29 From Martina Schildt | VZG To Everyone:
    Reacted to "Many times, we need ..." with 💯
18:33:49 From Owen Stephens To Everyone:
    Its a bit of a shame that we couldn’t have the agreements and orders functionality overlap here
18:33:57 From Martina Schildt | VZG To Everyone:
    Reacted to "Its a bit of a shame..." with 💯
18:34:06 From Maura Byrne To Everyone:
    Reacted to "Its a bit of a shame..." with 💯
18:34:55 From Owen Stephens To Everyone:
    I hate to keep beating the same drum - but so much of this Agreements does already…
18:35:14 From Charlotte Whitt To Everyone:
    Reacted to "Many times, we need ..." with 💯
18:37:01 From Charlotte Whitt To Everyone:
    + 1 Maura
18:37:06 From Martina Schildt | VZG To Everyone:
    Reacted to "+ 1 Maura" with 👍
18:37:14 From Dung-Lan Chen To Everyone:
    Newly available function in Orders "Version History" would keep track of POL updates in POLs that are created in Orchid.
18:37:30 From Maura Byrne To Everyone:
    Reacted to "Newly available func..." with 👍
18:37:57 From Charlotte Whitt To Everyone:
    @Owen Stephens  - maybe you can show us what you refer to, and then we can better visualize how this can substitute the ideas we had way back for Inventory
18:38:29 From Charlotte Whitt To Everyone:
    If we have the functionality, then we definitely should not duplicate this
18:38:43 From Owen Stephens To Everyone:
    But you can expire an agreement line - that’s the intention. And you can expire in a package as well - so two levels of flexibility there
18:39:37 From Dung-Lan Chen To Everyone:
    +! to Sara!!
18:40:19 From Owen Stephens To Everyone:
    I’m venting a little tbh. I don’t mean to suggest we pull everything apart
18:42:53 From scolglaz To Everyone:
    And an Ongoing order is forever until you or the vendor cancels … so a long time
18:42:54 From Lisa Smith - Mich State To Everyone:
    Mich State links POL titles to Package POLs.  We don't have most of our electronic titles in inventory; they are tracked through HLM.  (That's why I'm really interested in a filter!)  A plus for us is that we can 'unlink' from one Package POL and 'relink' to another.
18:43:06 From Charlotte Whitt To Everyone:
    Reacted to "And an Ongoing order..." with 👍🏻
18:43:28 From Dung-Lan Chen To Everyone:
    I was surprised when I first learned FOLIO was not designed to be an integrated library system when clearly there are certain areas within library operation that are closely linked together in order to work.
18:44:41 From Owen Stephens To Everyone:
    Replying to "Mich State links POL..."
    
    The Agreements app integrates with HLM via eHoldings
18:45:44 From Lisa Smith - Mich State To Everyone:
    Replying to "Mich State links POL..."
    
    Yes, which is great.  But when looking at the Package POL, we don't see what titles are included.
18:46:31 From Heather McMillan To Everyone:
    Owen - as soon as you can hook us up with sfx as our knowledge base. 🙂
18:48:18 From Heather McMillan To Everyone:
    nice!! Thank you! I will nudge him!
18:52:11 From Owen Stephens To Everyone:
    I think this is a good input for the “Serials” functionality as well because we hope that eventually this will deal with monographic series when they are part standing orders etc., but haven’t worked through this at all yet as we are focussing entirely on prediction patterns right now
18:54:15 From Jennifer Eustis To Everyone:
    Are there any issues that are still open or in draft for the container or for enhancing the Order Package?

Attendees

Action items