2025-08-11 Meeting notes

Date

Aug 11, 2025

Attendees

@Jenn Colt
@Jason Root
@Ingolf Kuss
@Tod Olson
@Craig McNally
@Charlotte Whitt
@Maccabee Levine
@Matt Weaver
@VBar
@Florian Gleixner
@Jakub Skoczen
@Oleksii Petrenko
@Kevin Day
@Marc Johnson

Time	Item	Who	Notes

Time	Item	Who	Notes
1 min	Scribe		@Julian Ladisch is next, followed by @Ingolf Kuss Reminder: Please copy/paste the Zoom chat into the notes. If you miss it, this is saved along with the meeting recording, but having it here has benefits.
5-15 min	Liaison Updates	@Maccabee Levine @Christie Thomas @Craig McNally	CC: @Maccabee Levine: Common understanding and agreement on core challenges facing the FOLIO with regard to community-sustained software development. Brief summaries of each artifact / model then structured input from each CC member and any interested community participant FOLIO Blueprint (slides) Contribution Network CDD Working Group Input invited in reaction doc (CC and beyond) PC: @Tod Olson filling in for @Christie Thomas Looking at relationship with SIG, how liaisons work Meeting planning for the near future Largely housekeeping RMS Group: 137 Tickets in the CSP, work is still in review Ticket FOLIO-4017 we need someone who could be responsible to these global settings. First identify all the details. @Jason Root will take on this work. Upgrade to Spring Boot version 4. Upgrade to version 4 in Umbrellaleaf. But Trillium will be in support long after June 2026. The Spring Boot release cadence is different from FOLIO release cadence. Umbrellaleaf will appear end of April. Many will run Trillium when Spring Boot 3 goes out of support. The change will be released as a CSP in Trillium, as some kind of backporting. Craig: Breaking Changes in a CSP seem risky. Oleksii: Not sure if modules will work with such a breaking change. We tried to understand all impacts of this breaking change. This work will be finished in a few weeks. First we need to understand the amount of the work. We have 35 Spring based modules in FOLIO. Plenty of work needs to be done for those. Could be little to no bugs or lots of bugs. Jason: For me that sounds like a major flower release, not a CSP. Maccabee: I would also bias towards delaying the release instead of putting it in a CSP. Oleksii: I am not comfortable to use unofficial, not released version. Oct 6 - Oct 31 is bugfest. If we want to adopt Spring Boot version 4 in Trillium, we need to delay this. We need to start bugfest with officially released version of Spring Boot. This will be in November. - For me it is better to stay with version 3.5.x and then upgrade to version 4 in Umbrellaleaf. Charlotte: It will also impact the National Library of Sweden. Marc J.: It makes sense to revisit this conversation in two weeks. Two options: 1. Upgrading and delaying the release. 2. Not upgrading at all. We will talk in two weeks and wait for the technical assessment to be done. Security Team: Eureka Early Adopters: @Craig McNally: Latest status updates can be found here , spreadsheet there is up-to-date Meeting every other week now Community Driven Development (@Jenn Colt / @Maccabee Levine): no news Wolfcon 2025: There will most likely be a shoulder meeting for the councils. Chairs continuing to discuss Friday schedule, would like as many folks who have come in person as possible to still be around for the tri-council session, might shorten individual sessions to facilitate?
5-10 min	Upcoming Meetings	All	Aug 11, 2025 - Regular TC meeting Aug 13, 2025 - Follow-up on 8/11 CC discussion of FOLIO Futures proposals. Unless we decide on 8/11 TC that there’s nothing to discuss yet. Aug 18, 2025 - Regular TC meeting Aug 20, 2025 - Dedicated discussion: Dedicated Discussion Topics: Revisit issues around breaking changes: https://github.com/folio-org/ui-courses/pull/349 PR has been merged New TC member orientation in Early July What do new members need to do? What does TC need to do around permissions in Wiki, GitHub; other administrative tasks? Appoint another co-chair FOLIO contribution network proposal: @Craig McNally Is this in discussion or for approval? @Jenn Colt Still in discussion Topic for next Wednesday’s meeting. What would TC’s perspective be on how a contribution network would operate? There are two related proposals that need to be considered and should be discussed more broadly. Developer Advocate Evaluating existing modules Communication plan to promote updates to OST pages Need to update OST pages with communication plan changes Need a retro on changes to OST(?) TC Roles and Responsibilities Has this been influenced by CC adopting a vision statement that the community should direct FOLIO development? OST discussion around the Grails 7 and Java 17 issues; get to talk to the stakeholders There might be a security issue to it. This is separate from the OST topic above. We might not be able to upgrade to Grails 7 for the Sunflower and we may not be able to get to this on Trillium. Is this in scope of Trillium, or do we need to put this on Umbrellaleaf? We need to schedule a meeting on this with the appropriate parties to plan this out. Issue about the Eureka release schedule - do we want to come back to it ? Continued third-party support during release periods Prompted by Kong/Keycloak and Spring Boot, plus extra-long Trillium cycle Should probably talk about this more generally, beyond these specific examples mod-mosaic and the Gobi group. Evaluation of existing modules: @Maccabee Levine created a spreadsheet with some information like age of repository on existing modules which could be used to see which modules need review. Julian also had the idea in slack to use sonar metrics to decide which modules get picked.
0 min	TCR Board Review	All	https://folio-org.atlassian.net/browse/TCR-57 @Julian Ladisch Not ready for evaluation yet. mod-mosaic has a lot of stuff under the licenses review. We will apply the same level of stringentness for the licenses as for lib-linked-data-rdf4ld. https://folio-org.atlassian.net/browse/TCR-58 ready for TC decision: https://github.com/folio-org/tech-council/pull/99/files @Kevin Day : Some have a licence under EDL / it is acceptable . EPL is not acceptable. We need to document this in the README. junit is EPL but it is in the exception list. We can also ignore EPL in http2-* . Only in Jakarta, the use of EPL is questionable. There is a lot here to discover. Marc J.: What does the TC do for future review with regards to these exceptions ? / Include Category B related licences . When will the subgroup meet again ? Maccabee: Some criteria fail because of problems with the criteria theirselves. Module approved by lazy consensus. Existing module evaluation process @Maccabee Levine shared some suggested talking points in #tc-internal Did not have time to discuss below mod-search (existing module evaluation) ui-export-manager (existing module evaluation) Co-Chairs will assign the people to evaluate.
0 min	Technical Council Sub-Groups Updates	All
1 min	GitHub RFCs Wiki RFCs	All	Anything we need to discuss here?
1 min	Decision Log	All
25 min	Officially Supported Technologies (OST)	All	https://folio-org.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/TC/pages/966852629/Umbrellaleaf POs have scope deadline of Aug 22
NA	Zoom Chat		Oleksii_Petrenko1 17:09 Hello everyone Charlotte Whitt 17:11 Adam Dickmeiss, has taken on the work on VERTXLIB-62 Sie 17:11 Sorry, what part of the Agenda does this discussion belong to = ? Jenn Colt 17:11 Still in RMS update Jenn Colt 17:13 https://open-libr-foundation.slack.com/archives/C210RP0T1/p1753302241593489 Jenn Colt 17:18 https://folio-org.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/PC/pages/418643971 Craig McNally 17:27 https://github.com/spring-projects/spring-boot/wiki/Spring-Boot-4.0.0-M2-Release-Notes https://github.com/spring-projects/spring-boot/wiki/Spring-Boot-4.0-Migration-Guide Jakub 17:29 Spring Boot usually has 5-7 milestone releases, version 4 is at M2 right now This would put GA sometime in early 2026, when is Trillium due? Jason Root 17:30 (Bearbeitet) Q4 2025 (Nov 10, 2025 - I think is the last date I saw) Charlotte Whitt 17:30 Trillium has currently feature freeze on 9/19 Craig McNally 17:32 (Bearbeitet) for 3.5 RC1 came out in April, and GA was out almost exactly 1 month later Craig McNally 17:31 If I'm not mistaken, spring usually tags a "release candidate" (RC) version which is usually very close to feature complete and should be stable. I don't know the timing of this though Maccabee Levine 17:32 (Bearbeitet) It could be worthwhile to diff some recent spring RCs vs the final production build, to prove that (or not) Maccabee Levine 17:35 Some people's concern about "significant upgrades during a CSP" may be specifically about Spring Boot, given how many parts it includes. Compared to some other dependencies. I don't think we're making a general statement. But worth discussing. Maccabee Levine 17:36 Thank you Oleksii! Jason Root 17:44 That was a lot of acronyms!

Topic Backlog
Decision Log Review	All	Review decisions that are in progress. Can any of them be accepted? rejected?
Translation Subgroup	All	Since we're having trouble finding volunteers for a subgroup, maybe we can make progress during a dedicated discussion session?
Communicating Breaking Changes	All	Currently there is a PoC, developed by @Maccabee Levine, of a utility to catalog Github PRs that have been labeled with the "breaking change" label. We would like to get developer feedback on the feasibility of this label being used more often, and the usefulness of this utility.
Officially Supported Technologies - Upkeep	All	Previous Notes: A workflow for these pages. When do they transition from one state to another. Do we even need statuses at all ? Stripes architecture group has some questions about the Poppy release. Zak: A handshake between developers, dev ops and the TC. Who makes that decision and how do we pass along that knowledge ? E.g. changes in Nodes and in the UI boxes. How to communicate this ? We have a large number of teams, all have to be aware of it. TC should be alerted that changes are happening. We have a couple of dedicated channels for that. Most dev ops have subscribed to these channels. How can dev ops folk raise issues to the next level of community awareness ? There hasn't been a specific piece of TC to move that along. Craig: There is a fourth group, "Capacity Planning" or "Release Planning". Slack is the de facto communication channel. There are no objections to using Slack. An example is the Java 17 RFC. Craig: The TC gets it on the agenda and we will discuss it. The TC gets the final say. Marc Johnson: We shouldn’t use the DevOps Channel. The dev ops folks have made it clear that it should only be used for support requests made to them. Jakub: Our responsibility is to avoid piling up technical debt. Marc: Some set of people have to actually make the call. Who lowers the chequered flag ? Craig: It needs to ultimately come to the TC at least for awareness. There is a missing piece. Capacity Planning needs to provide input here. Marc: Stakeholders / Capacity Planning could make that decision. Who makes the decision ? Is it the government or is it some parts of the body ? Marc: the developers community, the dev ops community and sys ops are involved. For example the Spring Framework discussion or the Java 17 discussion. But it was completely separate to the TC decision. It is a coordination and communication effort. Marc: Maybe the TC needs to let go that they are the decision makers so that they be a moderating group. Jakub: I agree with Marc. But we are not a system operating group. Dependency management should be in the responsibility of Release management. There are structures in the project for that. Jason Root: I agree with Jakub and with Marc also. Policies should drive operational/release/support aspects of Folio. Jason Root: If the idea of “support” is that frameworks are supported, then of course the project should meet that. Marc Johnson Some group needs to inform OleksAii when a relevant policy event occurs. These documents effectively ARE the manifestation of the policy. Craig: This is a topic for the next Monday session. Craig to see if Oleksii Petrenko could join us to discuss the process for updating the officially supported technologies lists.
Dev Documentation Visibility	All	Possible topic/activity for a Wednesday session: Discuss/brainstorm: Ideas for the type of developer-facing documentation we think would be most helpful for new developers How we might bring existing documentation up to date and ensure it's consistent etc.
API linting within our backend modules	All	https://folio-project.slack.com/archives/CAQ7L02PP/p1713343461518409 Hello team, I would like to discuss API linting within our backend modules. Some time ago, we transitioned our linting process from Jenkins to GitHub Actions as outlined in https://folio-org.atlassian.net/browse/FOLIO-3678. I am assuming that this move was done via some technical council decision. Please correct me if I'm wrong. In my observations, I've found two problems: Schema linting does not occur if the schemas are in YAML format. There are issues with resolving some deeper references during API linting. Although I'm unsure about how to improve the existing linting implementations within Folio, I propose to consider an open-source solution that handles OpenAPI linting effectively and allows us to define custom rules. For your reference: https://stoplight.io/open-source/spectral A test of this solution can be found in this PR: https://github.com/folio-org/mod-search/pull/567. The same PR also provides an example of custom rule definition: https://github.com/folio-org/mod-search/pull/567/files#diff-d5da7cb43c444434994b76f3b04aa6e702c09e938de09dbc09d72569d611d9ab.Also, by employing 'Spectral', I discovered AsyncAPI (https://www.asyncapi.com/en), an API design tool similar to OpenAPI but for asynchronous interactions. I suggest that we consider using AsyncAPI in FOLIO to generate documentation for Kafka interactions.
PR Templates	All	https://folio-project.slack.com/archives/CAQ7L02PP/p1713445649504769 Hello team, Small request to consider. Regarding pr templates. From my perspective, pr template is not good idea. Even the biggest open source projects that are contributed by many people don't have any pr template. Currently what we have for acq modules https://github.com/folio-org/mod-orders-storage/blob/master/PULL_REQUEST_TEMPLATE.md These pr template is inconsistent in different teams. What I suggest is that, pr template shouldn't be any instructions, because most developer who are creating pr have already understand the rules. If we put just two section into template, it will encourage developers to write more about their work and that lead to knowledge sharing among developers.
Proposed Mod Kafka	All	https://folio-project.slack.com/archives/CAQ7L02PP/p1714471592534689 Mike Taylor Proposal. If and only if a FOLIO instance is running Kafka, it should insert and enable a module called mod-kafka, which consists entirely of a module descriptor that says it provides the interface kafka. The purpose is so that other modules can use the standard <IfInterface> and similar tools to determine whether they should attempt Kafka operations. Rationale: the FOLIO ILS depends absolutely on Kafka, but other uses of the platform will not. One such example: a dev platform that includes only mod-users, used as a source of change events for Metadb.